I've worked in the food industry for 30 years and long heard lamenting about the declining citrus crop in Florida. But never heard this take on it. It sounds more than plausible.
The first question that comes to mind is whether other citrus growing regions (Brazil, Spain, Italy) are facing similar pestilence. If they are, especially if their standing with CCP is at least neutral if not positive, then it's likely a consequence of globalism. However, if this is mostly affecting US growers, then it's suspicious.
Given the arrests announced this week, the safe assumption is that CCP has definitely deployed biowarfare against us.
I think you should tone down your assumptions about GMO necessarily meaning nefarious bad faith. Look up regulatory approval, and follow the research projects regarding plant immunity to pathogens. It's often genuine efforts by well meaning people(also sometimes the big agrotech companies pushing pesticide).
I'm going towards plant physiology and plant breeding, and am enthusiastic about using GMO(eg for creating a tomato calyx that lowers pesticide needs). Plenty of people consider the tech desirable for good reasons.
I find breeding that makes plants less replantable to be more egregious.
You are correct, in general, but I think if a disease mysteriously showed up and some AgCorp had a GMO solution near-immediately, there would be a strong presumption of nefarious activity
That didn't happen, so what GMO stuff is going on surrounding it probably isn't nefarious
On the Ash tree devastation; I’ve always had reservations about describing the death of these ash trees in purely economic terms, dampening the way we interacted with the Ash. Namely the tree was one of the most popular street trees, lining the boulevards of cities. The tree was also a major timber for wood working, commonly used for interior furniture and baseball bats.
For another instance of an American tree being destroyed by a Chinese disease, admittedly this happened in the early 1900s, so likely an instance of self inflicted harm, look into the American Chestnut. It used to be one of the major trees in eastern forests, a major timber producer, and food crop. But the desire for a chestnut tree with a larger nut resulted in New Yorkers shipping in Chinese Chestnut, which was contaminated with chestnut blight. In 3 decades all the Chestnut stands were wiped out, and we’ve been trying to create a resistant variety ever since. The blight only kills the vascular tissue of the tree above the soil, so old roots will still put out new shoots of growth that will die shortly, haunting the forests they used to grow in.
Yes this is a good point, it’s far more than just economic damage. I was just trying to briefly describe the catastrophic scope and scale of what has happened, but you are right that there’s much more
I wasnt there but everything i have read, except what you write, has stated that chestnut blight arrived on on Castanea crenata (japanese chestnut), not C. mollissima (chinese chestnut).
There have been allegations of US agricultural biowarfare against China. This particular reference comes from "Metallicman", a spectacularly unreliable source, but there are other sources for this particular allegation. From Ron Unz in 2020:
" During 2018 a new Avian Flu virus had swept the country, eliminating large portions of China’s poultry industry, and during 2019 the Swine Flu viral epidemic had devastated China’s pig farms, destroying 40% of the nation’s primary domestic source of meat, with widespread claims that the latter disease was being spread by mysterious small drones. My morning newspapers had hardly ignored these important business stories, noting that the sudden collapse of much of China’s domestic food production might prove a huge boon to American farm exports at the height of our trade conflict, but I had never considered the obvious implications "
This is an eye-opener. Thank you for your diligence. I am sure this is a topic that will go over most peoples heads, or will be marked as conspiracy, but it’s important and should be discussed as a viable possibility. Unfortunately, I think as long as people have citrus in their grocery stores, they won’t care. The wake-up call will come when it is already too late.
This is probably true. I have found it strikes home with some people since the really good oranges just aren’t available anymore. But you are right that most will just write it off, for now
Excellent piece, thanks. I'm surprised you managed this so fast - just a few days after the news of two Chinese students arrested for carrying pathogens.
Chinese emigres are a very mixed group. Some are over here because of difficulties with the CCP (I know some who left because of religious persecution); they still have well-placed fears about the widespread monitoring posts that China runs in the West. Others are just following their career path and will most likely return to China at some stage. But some (many?) are within the military-command structure of the PLA, and even if they are not motivated by enthusiasm for the party-state, their fear of disobeying risky orders probably outstrips their fear of arrest and imprisonment abroad. Even the middle group can be cajoled or threatened into espionage or sabotage against their host countries.
Since part of the funding trail for violent unrest in the US (whether 2020 or 2025) leads back to China, it's in the interests of the US left to pretend that anyone voicing the least suspicion towards Chinese emigres is motivated by mindless racism. The Chinese have a contemptuous term - 白左 - for our leftists and their woke ideas, but the CCP is more than happy to exploit and nurture this foolishness for their own purposes.
Thanks! Yeah the orange issue has been on my mind for awhile, and when I first saw the arrests I figured it’d be a good avenue for tackling it
And yeah the emigres are a mixed group. I’ve found the ones who move here to escape the CCP are often alright, particularly if Christian converts, but the ones temporarily here as students, etc. are very much on the side of the CCP and PRC, not America
The wheat blight pathogen students were probably acting on their own. Think about it - if the CCP was planning to weaponize the pathogen they’d do so in China in secrecy THEN deploy in the US. Generally the simple conventional explanation is the right one. Lest you assume I’m an apologist for the CCP I have no doubt that they are aggressively seeking to enter our digital nervous system with ill intent. That’s the kind of risk we need to prioritize resourcing rather than chasing red herrings.
After COVID, it would be naive to think otherwise. On the other hand, just like you brought up, the US is a notoriously aggressive empire and a real threat to the Chinese. The Middle East is always a quick reminder of this, nowadays.
Biowarfare is truly horrendous. Even nukes only impact a large city at a time. Bioweapons cross sea to sea and often over seas. I guess the Chinese leaders simply don't care. Perhaps they embrace an attitude of prosperty thru extreme hardship.
First, don't be insulting. Not everything is "dumb" just because you don't immediately see the point of it.
On to your question: Apart from the $3 billion cost in the present that our host mentions, it has long-term value to the CCP as an experimental exercise to learn from.
The CCP has no interest in the destruction of the US economy at present, since they still urgently need to trade with the US (as the tariffs skirmish underlined). But in the future, if war, or substantial hostlities were to break out, then the CCP does indeed have an interest in doing exactly this. The exercises in sabotage at the present have a cumulative value that will be cashed out if the time comes for massive sabotage.
At a very simple level, compared to this, the Nazis sent "tourists" over to Norway before the planned invasion. These respectable looking single gentlemen were trained saboteurs who waited until it was time to make their move; the German invasion went very smoothly indeed because of their efforts.
This comment about testing the tactic is a great point as well. It could be argued that the orange blight was a test for the wheat blight they just tried releasing
It's a waste of time to complain about 'China' engaging in 'full spectrum war' when the US lets the Chinese - and every one else - come and go and buy land and businesses in the name of 'international commerce'.
The problem isn't 'China'.
The problem is 'Diversity is Our Strength'.
West Nile Virus came over in stagnant water in tires shipped into the US.
Foreign enemies matter though we have traitors at home. Further, helping people understand the cost of being an open society, such as the demolition of a treasured industry, is a great way to push against globalization
Blaming China on this plant disease sounds exactly like governments’ claims several decades ago in communist countries in Eastern Europe. When I was a kid, in my country the TV and newspapers had been shouting that USA is dropping potato bugs on potato crops. The thing was, the government was incompetent to address potato bug problem on the country level.
The US government failed your farmers - billions and trillions are being spent on wars and big corporations, while industry crushing problems are not addressed at all. Your president just spent 300M on poking holes in Iranian mountains. Opemerker may correctly claim that Brazil is aligned with China (In BRICS B stands for Brazil, C for China, right?), yet Italy and Spain are NATO countries supporting all US long term policies, definitely not aligned with China. Somehow they manage to deal with this problem. US government failed here. Same with rail infrastructure, education, public transport, homelessness, fentanyl epidemic etc. The US is collapsing into travesty of failing Soviet Union.
I've worked in the food industry for 30 years and long heard lamenting about the declining citrus crop in Florida. But never heard this take on it. It sounds more than plausible.
The first question that comes to mind is whether other citrus growing regions (Brazil, Spain, Italy) are facing similar pestilence. If they are, especially if their standing with CCP is at least neutral if not positive, then it's likely a consequence of globalism. However, if this is mostly affecting US growers, then it's suspicious.
Given the arrests announced this week, the safe assumption is that CCP has definitely deployed biowarfare against us.
Yeah, so it does cause trouble in Brazil, though to a lesser degree than in America, and it got there well after it arrived here
If GMO oranges could replace the diseased ones maybe China can be conveniently blamed while the alnswers might be closer to home ... Follow the money
Yeah, that would be a concern except that no GMO solution was waiting in the wings. It’s been two decades and nothing effective has been released, yet
Thank you for the clarification
I think you should tone down your assumptions about GMO necessarily meaning nefarious bad faith. Look up regulatory approval, and follow the research projects regarding plant immunity to pathogens. It's often genuine efforts by well meaning people(also sometimes the big agrotech companies pushing pesticide).
I'm going towards plant physiology and plant breeding, and am enthusiastic about using GMO(eg for creating a tomato calyx that lowers pesticide needs). Plenty of people consider the tech desirable for good reasons.
I find breeding that makes plants less replantable to be more egregious.
You are correct, in general, but I think if a disease mysteriously showed up and some AgCorp had a GMO solution near-immediately, there would be a strong presumption of nefarious activity
That didn't happen, so what GMO stuff is going on surrounding it probably isn't nefarious
Not definitive, but highly suspicious.
Yes
On the Ash tree devastation; I’ve always had reservations about describing the death of these ash trees in purely economic terms, dampening the way we interacted with the Ash. Namely the tree was one of the most popular street trees, lining the boulevards of cities. The tree was also a major timber for wood working, commonly used for interior furniture and baseball bats.
For another instance of an American tree being destroyed by a Chinese disease, admittedly this happened in the early 1900s, so likely an instance of self inflicted harm, look into the American Chestnut. It used to be one of the major trees in eastern forests, a major timber producer, and food crop. But the desire for a chestnut tree with a larger nut resulted in New Yorkers shipping in Chinese Chestnut, which was contaminated with chestnut blight. In 3 decades all the Chestnut stands were wiped out, and we’ve been trying to create a resistant variety ever since. The blight only kills the vascular tissue of the tree above the soil, so old roots will still put out new shoots of growth that will die shortly, haunting the forests they used to grow in.
Yes this is a good point, it’s far more than just economic damage. I was just trying to briefly describe the catastrophic scope and scale of what has happened, but you are right that there’s much more
I wasnt there but everything i have read, except what you write, has stated that chestnut blight arrived on on Castanea crenata (japanese chestnut), not C. mollissima (chinese chestnut).
There have been allegations of US agricultural biowarfare against China. This particular reference comes from "Metallicman", a spectacularly unreliable source, but there are other sources for this particular allegation. From Ron Unz in 2020:
" During 2018 a new Avian Flu virus had swept the country, eliminating large portions of China’s poultry industry, and during 2019 the Swine Flu viral epidemic had devastated China’s pig farms, destroying 40% of the nation’s primary domestic source of meat, with widespread claims that the latter disease was being spread by mysterious small drones. My morning newspapers had hardly ignored these important business stories, noting that the sudden collapse of much of China’s domestic food production might prove a huge boon to American farm exports at the height of our trade conflict, but I had never considered the obvious implications "
Very interesting, thanks
Any acre of land that is owned by China should be confiscated
This is an eye-opener. Thank you for your diligence. I am sure this is a topic that will go over most peoples heads, or will be marked as conspiracy, but it’s important and should be discussed as a viable possibility. Unfortunately, I think as long as people have citrus in their grocery stores, they won’t care. The wake-up call will come when it is already too late.
This is probably true. I have found it strikes home with some people since the really good oranges just aren’t available anymore. But you are right that most will just write it off, for now
Excellent piece, thanks. I'm surprised you managed this so fast - just a few days after the news of two Chinese students arrested for carrying pathogens.
Chinese emigres are a very mixed group. Some are over here because of difficulties with the CCP (I know some who left because of religious persecution); they still have well-placed fears about the widespread monitoring posts that China runs in the West. Others are just following their career path and will most likely return to China at some stage. But some (many?) are within the military-command structure of the PLA, and even if they are not motivated by enthusiasm for the party-state, their fear of disobeying risky orders probably outstrips their fear of arrest and imprisonment abroad. Even the middle group can be cajoled or threatened into espionage or sabotage against their host countries.
Since part of the funding trail for violent unrest in the US (whether 2020 or 2025) leads back to China, it's in the interests of the US left to pretend that anyone voicing the least suspicion towards Chinese emigres is motivated by mindless racism. The Chinese have a contemptuous term - 白左 - for our leftists and their woke ideas, but the CCP is more than happy to exploit and nurture this foolishness for their own purposes.
Thanks! Yeah the orange issue has been on my mind for awhile, and when I first saw the arrests I figured it’d be a good avenue for tackling it
And yeah the emigres are a mixed group. I’ve found the ones who move here to escape the CCP are often alright, particularly if Christian converts, but the ones temporarily here as students, etc. are very much on the side of the CCP and PRC, not America
The wheat blight pathogen students were probably acting on their own. Think about it - if the CCP was planning to weaponize the pathogen they’d do so in China in secrecy THEN deploy in the US. Generally the simple conventional explanation is the right one. Lest you assume I’m an apologist for the CCP I have no doubt that they are aggressively seeking to enter our digital nervous system with ill intent. That’s the kind of risk we need to prioritize resourcing rather than chasing red herrings.
After COVID, it would be naive to think otherwise. On the other hand, just like you brought up, the US is a notoriously aggressive empire and a real threat to the Chinese. The Middle East is always a quick reminder of this, nowadays.
Biowarfare is truly horrendous. Even nukes only impact a large city at a time. Bioweapons cross sea to sea and often over seas. I guess the Chinese leaders simply don't care. Perhaps they embrace an attitude of prosperty thru extreme hardship.
Yes, biowarfare is utterly terrifying to me
This is dumb.
What would be the point of sabotaging citrus fruits?
$3 billion in economic damage
First, don't be insulting. Not everything is "dumb" just because you don't immediately see the point of it.
On to your question: Apart from the $3 billion cost in the present that our host mentions, it has long-term value to the CCP as an experimental exercise to learn from.
The CCP has no interest in the destruction of the US economy at present, since they still urgently need to trade with the US (as the tariffs skirmish underlined). But in the future, if war, or substantial hostlities were to break out, then the CCP does indeed have an interest in doing exactly this. The exercises in sabotage at the present have a cumulative value that will be cashed out if the time comes for massive sabotage.
At a very simple level, compared to this, the Nazis sent "tourists" over to Norway before the planned invasion. These respectable looking single gentlemen were trained saboteurs who waited until it was time to make their move; the German invasion went very smoothly indeed because of their efforts.
This comment about testing the tactic is a great point as well. It could be argued that the orange blight was a test for the wheat blight they just tried releasing
That’s ultimately 3 billion dollars less that Americans will spend on buying Chinese crap tho
About as likely as America attacking Ireland with the potato blight and causing the famine of 1845.
Suddenly that becomes an interesting thought!
It's a waste of time to complain about 'China' engaging in 'full spectrum war' when the US lets the Chinese - and every one else - come and go and buy land and businesses in the name of 'international commerce'.
The problem isn't 'China'.
The problem is 'Diversity is Our Strength'.
West Nile Virus came over in stagnant water in tires shipped into the US.
Foreign enemies matter though we have traitors at home. Further, helping people understand the cost of being an open society, such as the demolition of a treasured industry, is a great way to push against globalization
Blaming China on this plant disease sounds exactly like governments’ claims several decades ago in communist countries in Eastern Europe. When I was a kid, in my country the TV and newspapers had been shouting that USA is dropping potato bugs on potato crops. The thing was, the government was incompetent to address potato bug problem on the country level.
The US government failed your farmers - billions and trillions are being spent on wars and big corporations, while industry crushing problems are not addressed at all. Your president just spent 300M on poking holes in Iranian mountains. Opemerker may correctly claim that Brazil is aligned with China (In BRICS B stands for Brazil, C for China, right?), yet Italy and Spain are NATO countries supporting all US long term policies, definitely not aligned with China. Somehow they manage to deal with this problem. US government failed here. Same with rail infrastructure, education, public transport, homelessness, fentanyl epidemic etc. The US is collapsing into travesty of failing Soviet Union.